[Update TWO: 31052014] Fund Raising For Roy Ngerng’s Court Case Against Lee Hsien Loong

Dear Singaporeans, today is at the Day 2 mark of the fund raising. We have managed to reach the half-way mark for the fund raising! Thank you so much for assisting this. Hopefully we will be able to meet the target soon. You can read more about what the court and the fund raising appeal here.

More Singaporeans have reached out to show your support and to also thank me for speaking up for the CPF. I will continue to stay strong and fight for our rights. We are in this together. Let’s make our fight worth it!

As I had shared on my Facebook, I will update on the funds raised to be transparent and accountable. Please see below for further information on the funds raised so far, as of 5.00pm today.

Funds Raised So Far

We have raised $36,606.05 so far. We would still need to raise another $33,393.95. The target is $70,000.

Funds Raised  by 31 May 2014 5pm

Transaction Histories

Please see below the transaction histories of the bank accounts.

Below is the transaction history for the POSB Savings Bank Account 130-23068-7 (Ngerng Yi Ling). This is my personal bank account.

$33,977.12 has been raised from here.

POSB 30 to 31 May 2014-page-001

POSB 30 to 31 May 2014-page-002

POSB 30 to 31 May 2014-page-003

POSB 30 to 31 May 2014-page-004

POSB 30 to 31 May 2014-page-005

POSB 30 to 31 May 2014-page-006 cropped

Below is the transaction history for the OCBC Savings Bank Account 657-4-111750 (Ngerng Mui Choo). My father helped set up this bank account yesterday solely for this fund raising.

$1,283.59 has been raised from here.

OCBC 30 to 31 May 2014a

OCBC 30 to 31 May 2014b

Below is the transaction history for PayPal. Someone found my PayPal account and sent the funds via PayPal to me. Please note that the PayPal is linked to my personal POSB bank account. I will include these amounts in the funds raised when they enter my personal POSB bank account, for ease of accounting.

$1,840.3 has been raised from here (after deducting for PayPal fees and conversion).

Paypal 30 to 31 May 2014

Finally, I have also received $1,350 in cash from concerned Singaporeans at a volunteer event today.

10351683_10152282678362819_2857878130739845682_n

To Transfer Funds

wpid-support-roy-ngerngs-defamation-legal-defense-fund-with-text.jpg

If you would like to contribute to the cause, you can make a deposit to POSB Savings Account Number 130-23068-7 (Ngerng Yi Ling). This is the main avenue for the fund raising.

Some people have also asked me about fund transfers via other options. I have managed to find out from the bank and compiled a list below based on the queries.

Method Details
Bank transfer or cheque Transfer to: POSB Savings Account Number 130-23068-7 (Ngerng Yi Ling)Transfer to: OCBC Savings Bank Account 657-4-111750 (Ngerng Mui Choo) – this account was set up by my father solely for the fund raising
Cash (in person) Please write to me at royngerng@gmail.com for the address
Cash or cheque (snail mail) Please write to me at royngerng@gmail.com for the address
Overseas transfer DBS Bank Ltd12 Marina BoulevardDBS Asia CentralMarina Bay Financial Centre Tower 3Singapore 018982Swift address: DBSSSGSG

Bank code: 7171

Branch code: 081

 

POSB Savings Account Number: 130-23068-7

POSB Savings Account Name: Ngerng Yi Ling

Thank you very much for standing behind Ravi and I. We hope that we will be able to represent Singaporeans and fight for our right to know.

On 7 June, we will be organising an event to demand to the Singapore government to #ReturnOurCPF. Read our demands below.

We have also set up a petition that you can sign here.

We look forward to seeing you on 7 June. The Facebook event page can be found here.

Return Our CPF Colour Boxes 2b@English

Return Our CPF Colour Boxes 2b@Chinese@without de

 

317 comments

  1. CPF Fan

    The CPF system has worked very well for almost all Singaporeans. If you want the SG Govt to return the CPF at 55 and then citizens have say another 20-30 years to live but they squander away the CPF money, then they will have new reasons to vent their frustrations against the govt. Singaporeans always have something to complain about. I believe Roy is going to lose this court case saddled with heavy debts – new reason to hate the Govt again !!

    • CPF Fan

      No, I will not donate my money as I already know your outcome. These people who donated small sums to you are only using you to get answers through the court, and then when time comes for your bankruptcy they will all go into hiding.

      • kool

        Conditions have to be made. Those who opt out will be left on their own. They should never expect the government to help should they used up all their money because these are also nations money from you and me. I will be against to help any such people. But I will agree to let these people opt out, its up to them and give them their wish to do their own investment to get more returns.

      • Francis

        I think at the end he may need one more zero behind his target number…

        feel sad to see someone screwing up his life, while thinking he is a hero..

      • Justice Bao

        Nobody asked you to donate and i am sure nobody asked you to give your worthless opinion on those who do donate. So shut the fuck up.

      • Donna

        Look at this good dog. He only talks when asked by his master to. That’s why he imposes his assumptions for speaking onto everyone else.

    • Chris

      What makes you say that CPF has worked very well? The CPF’s purpose is to provide for the needs of the citizens in their old age. Since most people fail to meet the minimum sum, and in fact, many people’s account are cleaned out by their 30 year HDB mortgages, how is it that CPF “has worked very well”? I’m not trying to be a wise guy, I’m just curious how you came to this conclusion.

      • CPF Fan

        You mean you don’t use CPF to buy house. When time to retire, you can always downgrade and make money from the sale of your flat. I know some older citizens who have done this. It’s a win-win situation. And just because we have CPF doesn’t mean we don’t do our own savings.

      • candid

        4% interest in medisave and special. I really hope policy would change to allow you to opt out and agree that should you run into debt, you are left to settle it on your own. I wonder how many people and yourself will really opt out shld this day come.

      • Chris

        Hi Chris,
        Another Chris here.
        Sadly, u r another poor soul who dun read every thing on our cpf website. Many options r available like pledging of ur HDB, silver housing bonus and lease buy back scheme. U need to spend efforts to read….
        I have spent quite a while to have exchanges with some Roy fans here… U can spend some time reading those….
        What the govt had done is not that as bad as some ppl make it to look. What kind of thinking does such ppl have? I really dun know. Only they and god will know…
        As long as ppl live within their means, u will retire well. The sad cases will be the really poor ppl whom the govt continues to reach out to.
        As for those who engage in vices, good luck to them. I hope the govt dun help them though…
        Chris, nice nick… Love it. 🙂

      • Francis

        I think the CPF Fan needs repair. No one in the right mind would want to sell off their homes to retire. If most people have to do that, it can only mean that the CPF scheme is a scam.

      • Chris

        Then dun use ur cpf to buy HDB Loh. Use ur cash.
        It is not a scheme!
        U can dun use it if u dun want.

      • Justice Bao

        It fails when it makes it harder to simply just get your cash when you reach 55.

        It doesn’t matter how much you have, you can even strike 4D and be super rich. But your CPF is still your own cash and you deserve to have all of it when you hit 55. That’s your cash and your rights.

      • Albert Ng

        asking for higher CPF payout is benefitting the rich more, the people who benefit most are the high income group who got higher balance in CPF, those who don’t need to withdraw for housing. Who lost out the most? is the jobless and low income.
        So is Roy fighting for the rich or for the poor?

        If CPF interest is 6% or 10% the rich will not touch CPF for housing, using their normal saving to pay for housing will be a better choice, correct? To the lower income if they don’t use CPF to pay for HDB where else to get the money from? So you can clearly see Roy’s ploy is benefitting the rich more than the poor.

        People who donate money to Roy are fighting for the rich and make the poor poorer, I don’t have to say more.

      • M

        Then when there will be a new thing to complain oh govt not taking care of citizen…jk you think govt never think of this??? There are many factor as to y it is a must for every Singaporean have a CPF account… I find it a joke…overseas govt are learning from our CPF system yet people in Sg want to follow oversea’s footsteps which have failed before…

      • Chris

        I wish it is as simple. I advocate to allow ppl to have the option.
        But if shit happens how can govt forsake them in a humane manner, even if the laws allow.
        The best way is for the naysayer to leave. But they dun want to. Which is within their right too.
        Thus, the best way is everyone must listen to the elected govt because they have the ppl’s mandate.

    • SC

      Many people support Roy and other opposition just because they think the PAP isn’t doing well enough. What they don’t realise is that precisely because the PAP isn’t good enough, we can’t afford to support someone else who is even less capable.

      The opposition tries very hard to convince Singaporeans that the PAP has bad intentions. But if we examine both sides of the stories carefully, it is clear that when there’s anything wrong with the government at all, it’s almost always because their policies backfire and fail to deliver what they hoped for.The problem lies in the capability of the government, not their intentions.

      The opposition does pressurise the incumbent, but in Singapore this pressure doesn’t translate to any improvement on the government’s performance, because the government simply doesn’t know how to do things better, and neither does the opposition. To date, WP have hardly achieved anything they’ve promised without screwing up the situation further. Let alone Roy and his friends, who advocate appealing but empty causes that obviously do Singapore no good if put into practice.

      • Ryan Scs

        SC I really hope you carefully go through everything in hdb n cpf websites. If you can make a simple calculation you will start to realised. For example, studio appt looks cheap and affordable but when you multiplied by 3 to make till worth 90 years and not a 2 rooms 99 years, it will cost you as high as $330,000 per unit! As for cpf, which insurance company you came across willing to loose money on new scheme? If you withdraw $1000 a month from annuity, $149,000 will last you till age of 79 and 5 months if you still there by then and this doesn’t include interest. Did government show you actual statistics on age group and life expectancy?

      • Chris

        U can move to m’sia, a lot of empty houses there for many ppl.
        The only resource is land in Singapore. If Singapore is worthless, u flat, private property, commercial and such will be empty. U want it to be in that manner?
        I’m a young Singaporean, I want to have a cheap and big flat same priced as my dad’s. But my dad want his flat to increase in price. So how?
        China property only 70 yr lease, some location selling like hot cakes and more or less similar priced as Singapore. Some more, china is so big.
        Every country has it’s own reason for doing up its policies. Dun complain so much… Work hard and be prudent. As long as govt is trying to bring in high value jobs. We should b ok.

    • Albert Ng

      asking for higher CPF payout is benefitting the rich more, the people who benefit most are the high income group who got higher balance in CPF, those who don’t need to withdraw for housing. Who lost out the most? is the jobless and low income.
      So is Roy fighting for the rich or for the poor?

      If CPF interest is 6% or 10% the rich will not touch CPF for housing, using their normal saving to pay for housing will be a better choice, correct? To the lower income if they don’t use CPF to pay for HDB where else to get the money from? So you can clearly see Roy’s ploy is benefitting the rich more than the poor.

      People who donate money to Roy are fighting for the rich and make the poor poorer, I don’t have to say more.

      • uncle lim

        Which ever party voted in for the terms as government of Singapore. They are therefore, being entrusted by the majority of Singaporean to take care and charge of our island for the elected terms only.
        So, Singapore is belong to all of us (Singaporean). No to individual (Citizen) and/or (Government). If one is not committed into any major issues (Law) that require to depot out of Singapore.
        Other then that, NO ANY CITIZENS AND GOVERNMENT CAN SUKA SUKA TELL SINGAPOREAN TO LEAVE IF WE ARE NOT LIKE IT HERE.
        Please wake up your idea ! Weak up from your sleep!

    • Daniel Chua

      You think I stupid? Come meet me face to face and let me tell you how to live prudently. I am the group affected by the policy. The lesser ok citizens needs the money. If I had not been lucky to recover from mild stroke. .I will have to wait 10 years to see my CPF just to be able to see doctor.

      • May

        So you recieved CPF after recovering from your stroke, isn’t that a good thing? Imagine if you had no CPF, you’ve spent your money not ever imagining you are going to get stroke, what are you going to pay the doctors with?

      • Chris

        Daniel,
        No one in sg will be denied medical, even if u r downtrodden. I’ll call wan bao for u if u r denied. In a few days mr gan will ask the hospital directors to his office…
        Dun worry…
        But if u can pay but dun want to pay, then no one can help u

    • Yang

      Well, i strongly disagree. It’s my money, and it’s up to me on how i wanna manage it.

      If this is your reason to support the CPF system, then i must say you need some discipline my friend.

  2. Shimensoka

    Roy could you asdvise how to find you on paypal as I am base overseas and can only do so via paypal.

    • Albert Ng

      asking for higher CPF payout is benefitting the rich more, the people who benefit most are the high income group who got higher balance in CPF, those who don’t need to withdraw for housing. Who lost out the most? is the jobless and low income.
      So is Roy fighting for the rich or for the poor?

      If CPF interest is 6% or 10% the rich will not touch CPF for housing, using their normal saving to pay for housing will be a better choice, correct? To the lower income if they don’t use CPF to pay for HDB where else to get the money from? So you can clearly see Roy’s ploy is benefitting the rich more than the poor.

      People who donate money to Roy are fighting for the rich and make the poor poorer, I don’t have to say more.

  3. True Singaporean

    Power to the people. We want to see LHL go down.
    Go Roy, defeat the bad guy.!
    We true Singaporeans fully support you.
    Screw the rest of the sinkies. 🙂 🙂 🙂

    • Francis

      really ? u want to see a PM go down ? what did he do wrong here? he was accused by someone without any evidence.

      and u wanna screw other singaporeans who dont support your opinion?

    • Francis

      Well said. Truly Singaporean. The PM must step down for making us sell our roof in order to retire. Only retards will support such a crazy idea. No other pension funds in the world require their citizens to sell their homes to retire. Retarded sinkies.

      • May

        People from overseas don’t have this kind of over attachment to their houses. I personally know many people from other countries who on their own accord downgrade their houses for retirement. Their reasoning is simple, 1) I don’t need so much space any more. 2) bigger place means for cleaning and jobs to be done. 3) moving to a community that accommodates older people makes life easier for myself. 4) the extra cash I get gives me a comfortable living. And the government didn’t even need to interfere, the people know themselves what’s good for them. How about Sg? Full of selfish ppl who wants to look rich by having a big house?

      • goh kan heng

        Erm.. in America, the people own their own freehold houses. Never do they need to downgrade because they have sufficient retirement funds. In Singapore, people bought expensive leasehold HDB flats, all their money is stuck in HDB mortgage. They are forced to downgrade. The situation is so different. If you compare with the west, their houses are 300-400 sqm with a garden. Singaporeans own 90sqm and need to downgrade to 35sqm? Not much different from a cage.

    • Chris

      I’m a true Singaporean.
      I hate CSJ. I dislike this Roy.
      U r free to vote or leave our country.
      No pension fund allows ppl to use their pension funds to buy houses too. U can dun use ur cpf to buy ur HDB.
      Dun any how say when u dun have the full facts.

      • Bran

        Please remember that the pension fund you’re using to buy HDB is also government owned or part-owned and its prices have been soaring sky high in recent times; furthermore the lease is capped so the house isn’t entirely yours. Therefore I think that your example of “other country cannot use pension fund to buy houses” is invalid and you just shot your own foot.

        The government introduced HDBs to provide citizens of Singapore with a form of affordable housing in our small island country with scarce land space. Prices have gone up to ridiculous amounts due to lack of control measures and yet you applaud our government for blessing us the option of buying a ridiculously priced home with our pension fund, without actually owning it?

        This is coming from a young, and maybe inexperienced Singaporean who’s working his ass off to try and build a life in this country he calls home. Looking forward to your feedbacks so that maybe you can teach me a good thing or two about this government.

      • Daniel Chua

        I am not a fan of both but want to see the court proceedings and I want to manage my own CPF..ssimple?

      • Chris

        In Asia context, many countries’ land is ultimately belongs to govt. govt is elected by the ppl… Do u want to own ur flat forever?
        Then migrate to USA. U own the land u buy (in some states, not all).

    • Albert Ng

      asking for higher CPF payout is benefitting the rich more, the people who benefit most are the high income group who got higher balance in CPF, those who don’t need to withdraw for housing. Who lost out the most? is the jobless and low income.
      So is Roy fighting for the rich or for the poor?

      If CPF interest is 6% or 10% the rich will not touch CPF for housing, using their normal saving to pay for housing will be a better choice, correct? To the lower income if they don’t use CPF to pay for HDB where else to get the money from? So you can clearly see Roy’s ploy is benefitting the rich more than the poor.

      People who donate money to Roy are fighting for the rich and make the poor poorer, I don’t have to say more.

      • DT

        U are barking at the wrong tree. The rich are rich so they will not buy HDB. I also dont understand the your rationale that the riches using their cash to buy housing. So If I myself can make 10% anuualised return, why should I lose out my compounded return over few decades to the low returns of CPF ?
        Why Dont you ask the govt to stop GST on essential items ? why dont you ask the civil servants to cut their pay. Why don’t ask your company not to increase your pay just because the cleaners or coffee lady is earning much lesser than you.

        I felt pathetic for this so called first world country !

      • eddie fonso

        Bran u r right! Where in the world can foreigners(PRs) buy public housing meant for Citizens ?

    • Justice Bao

      Agree we don’t need him as PM. As rich as anyone are it still begs a question why our country have to keep on paying their high salaries only for them to keep making policy that make us pay more and more for nuts policy.

      • Albert Ng

        asking for higher CPF payout is benefitting the rich more, the people who benefit most are the high income group who got higher balance in CPF, those who don’t need to withdraw for housing. Who lost out the most? is the jobless and low income.
        So is Roy fighting for the rich or for the poor?

        If CPF interest is 6% or 10% the rich will not touch CPF for housing, using their normal saving to pay for housing will be a better choice, correct? To the lower income if they don’t use CPF to pay for HDB where else to get the money from? So you can clearly see Roy’s ploy is benefitting the rich more than the poor.

        People who donate money to Roy are fighting for the rich and make the poor poorer, I don’t have to say more.

      • Francis

        TO THOSE RETARDS WHO ASK PEOPLE TO LEAVE THEIR OWN COUNTRY, FUCK YOU!

        SINGAPORE IS THE ONLY COUNTRY WHERE CITIZENS TELL OTHER CITIZENS TO LEAVE.

        FUCK PAP!

      • Chris

        TO THOSE RETARDS WHO ASK PEOPLE TO LEAVE THEIR OWN COUNTRY, FUCK YOU!

        SINGAPORE IS THE ONLY COUNTRY WHERE CITIZENS TELL OTHER CITIZENS TO LEAVE.

        FUCK PAP!

      • Chris

        Chris,
        Why so many fouled mouth ppl here. Just becos u r behind ur screen. It doesn’t mean u can downgrade urself and ur dignity. Or r u like that in real life…

      • Greg

        I hate to say this Chris, but people say that in the USA too. “USA, love it or leave it”. I think this may be more universal than you think. I think it’s a way people who don’t have a good argument try to show that they are in the right, when in many cases there is no right. In this case from outside of your country, I don’t see the financial issue, but I see a critic of the government, right or wrong, it does not matter, being manipulated into silence using financial pressures. Perhaps from the outside I see things differently, as I am used to being able to criticize my government, and if I do, being ignored :). Mind you this would not be the issue it was if your leader just ignored it.

      • Chris

        Greg,
        On this matter of our leader dismissing this case is not in our culture. Becos Singaporeans in general r very strict and work according to law, rules and regulations.
        If u dun dismiss allegations in public strongly, there will be pockets of citizens who think there is some truth in such allegations.
        We do not have as strong an identity as America. Not rich like america. No “Singapore feel good” movies like America. Sadly, we r very vulnerable as a nation not like America.

      • goh kan heng

        I think the allegation of defamation is an allegation to begin with. We need proper laws to protect whistle blowers like the Hong Kong ICAC. Even their Chief Executive is not exempted from corruption investigation because ICAC is totally independent. Singapore CPIB, on the other hand, cannot check on the PM because its office is directly under PMO. Even the PM cannot explain why there is such an arrangement? Where is the transparency?

      • Greg

        Was there a post deleted here? The post I was replying to that said no other countries would have a citizen tell another to leave seems not to be there any more.

        Chris, I do see your point (mentioned it a post further down) that your leader needed to sue or be seen as agreeing with the charges. This is a culture thing, and not a feel good movie thing (we actually have more films about a president making mistakes or just being stupid or naive than we do heros. In the USA this may come from a debate culture. Our president on a daily basis has to answer questions from the press, has to debate in public to run for office. I know this does not happen in all countries. Does it happen in Singapore? From this outside this goes back to credibility. People win arguments with credibility. In the USA this was demonstrated when Ronald Regan in a debate against Jimmy Carter the sitting president argued that Trees cause pollution. (google it, not making this up). another example was when Richard Nixon, a man who would become president years later, but was running with another man to become Vice President, had to fix his image. He had some problems. He gave what is called “The Checkers Speach” he did not talk about the problem, he talked about himself, his new dog, and at a certain point people would not believe the charges against him because his credibility was too high. I find it strange from the point of view of someone who is an ousider to you, that a world leader needs to sue someone instead of just dismissing him.

      • Chris

        Hi Greg
        Watch too many USA movies on this feel good thingy… No offence.
        As for ur comments on movies making fun of ur presidents.
        I suddenly remember lots of Singapore movies that make fun of our govt policies, culture and the way public figures behave. We have lots of such movies here. None of them r sued becos they just make fun using real senario and background information. So no one slandered anyone.
        Just to let u know, so that u dun think us Singaporeans r “robots” with no humour.

    • Albert Ng

      asking for higher CPF payout is benefitting the rich more, the people who benefit most are the high income group who got higher balance in CPF, those who don’t need to withdraw for housing. Who lost out the most? is the jobless and low income.
      So is Roy fighting for the rich or for the poor?

      If CPF interest is 6% or 10% the rich will not touch CPF for housing, using their normal saving to pay for housing will be a better choice, correct? To the lower income if they don’t use CPF to pay for HDB where else to get the money from? So you can clearly see Roy’s ploy is benefitting the rich more than the poor.

      People who donate money to Roy are fighting for the rich and make the poor poorer, I don’t have to say more.

  4. 1kickko

    so will this loser return $$ to the public he get in need… or expect other to fully pay for the mistake he make herself by maliciously slip tongue… accuse other for using others $$, so she is doing the same thing & have no liabilities for her own problem.. not doing anything better than what he protesting on..what a contradict.. good at confusing the line with words of sweetness

  5. Pingback: CPF blogger raised $36,600 within two days. That’s $6,600 more than what Chee Soon Juan paid ex-PMs LKY & GCT in settlement. | Mothership.SG
  6. I don't want to enter my grave in fear, just like those before us.

    Can any Singaporean who can write Malay, kindly translate the slogans above to Malay for the benefit of our Malay Singaporeans? Sama sama, please. Also, could the Indian Singaporeans bros and sis, kindly translate the slogan to Tamil? Do your part for liberty. Otherwise, the Big Bully (you know who) doesn’t stop his bad behavior towards ordinary Singaporeans.

    • Albert Ng

      asking for higher CPF payout is benefitting the rich more, the people who benefit most are the high income group who got higher balance in CPF, those who don’t need to withdraw for housing. Who lost out the most? is the jobless and low income.
      So is Roy fighting for the rich or for the poor?

      If CPF interest is 6% or 10% the rich will not touch CPF for housing, using their normal saving to pay for housing will be a better choice, correct? To the lower income if they don’t use CPF to pay for HDB where else to get the money from? So you can clearly see Roy’s ploy is benefitting the rich more than the poor.

      People who donate money to Roy are fighting for the rich and make the poor poorer, I don’t have to say more.

  7. Francis

    TO THOSE RETARDS WHO ADVOCATE PEOPLE TO SELL OFF THEIR HOMES TO RETIRE, FUCK YOU!

    SINGAPORE IS THE ONLY COUNTRY IN THE WORLD THAT TELLS ITS CITIZENS TO SELL THEIR HOMES AND DOWNGRADE TO RETIRE.

    FUCK PAP!

    • stoop

      You want to bring your home to your graveyard? Didn’t people says they cannot may not even live that long to be able to use their CPF money?

    • Chris

      Francis,
      Then use cash to buy ur HDB lo.
      No country in the world allow u to use ur pension fund to buy houses.
      Govt give u an option but still get falsely accused.
      R u an idiot?
      Mind ur Langauge…

      • Francis

        chris..I am the other francis. so u can see the opposition supporters often use bad language and insult people who dont support them. so typical of them…

      • Chris

        Yes Francis,
        I was retiring from this blog. But I hate it that ppl continues to make unfair accusations.
        Maybe not just oppositions but ignorant Singaporeans who dun read from cpf and HDB websites to get real information. They rather trust someone who copy and paste from such official websites.

      • Chris

        TO THOSE RETARDS WHO ADVOCATE USING CASH TO PAY FOR HDB, FUCK YOU!

        SINGAPORE IS THE ONLY COUNTRY THAT SELLS PUBLIC HOUSING AT HUGE PROFIT, CAUSING CITIZENS NOT ABLE TO PAY WITH CASH ALONE.

        FUCK PAP!

      • Chris

        Be gracious because it is not right to use unruly Langauge.
        Some of these ppl may be foreigners trying to pour oil into fire… No need to stoop to their level.

    • Francis

      TO THOSE RETARDS WHO ADVOCATE USING CASH TO PAY FOR HDB, FUCK YOU!

      SINGAPORE IS THE ONLY COUNTRY THAT SELLS PUBLIC HOUSING AT HUGE PROFIT, CAUSING CITIZENS NOT ABLE TO PAY WITH CASH ALONE.

      FUCK PAP!

      • Leonard

        Maybe the reason is because the quality of public housing in other countries are much lower as they are only for the lowest income group. So all other citizens have to buy private housings

      • Francis

        What is the root cause of this? Since when should a basic roof be so expensive? Is there condo facilities? Contractors have to bid the lowest to get the job. If you look at the contract sum for each BTO project, the effective cost of a four roomer is around $100,000. All cheap labour from blangadesh and india. Why HDB is charging $300,000?

      • Chris

        This Francis,
        If u r a Singaporean then u r really silly. And ur mouth is extremely foul. To stoop to ur standard is a disgrace to mankind and Singapore.
        If u are a foreigner posing as a Singaporean then u can go and fly kite. Did no one teach u manners?

      • Chris

        This Chris,
        If u r a Singaporean then u r really silly. And ur mouth is extremely foul. To stoop to ur standard is a disgrace to mankind and Singapore.
        If u are a foreigner posing as a Singaporean then u can go and fly kite. Did no one teach u manners?

      • goh kan heng

        Hey the blue colour Chris, why engage in ad hominem? I thought you have something to counter Francis on his claim that HDB is overcharging Singaporeans for the BTO flats. Or you run out of thoughts?

      • Chris

        Well Goh,
        Not that la, I’ve explained before Liao but he never read. Cannot keep explaining ma… I not govt leh, so I no patience to keep repeating my answers.
        But I’ll give him a hint. Land is not cheap in Singapore. And u won’t want Singapore land to be cheap else u will also be “cheap”…
        If dun understand then read my posting.

    • Albert Ng

      asking for higher CPF payout is benefitting the rich more, the people who benefit most are the high income group who got higher balance in CPF, those who don’t need to withdraw for housing. Who lost out the most? is the jobless and low income.
      So is Roy fighting for the rich or for the poor?

      If CPF interest is 6% or 10% the rich will not touch CPF for housing, using their normal saving to pay for housing will be a better choice, correct? To the lower income if they don’t use CPF to pay for HDB where else to get the money from? So you can clearly see Roy’s ploy is benefitting the rich more than the poor.

      People who donate money to Roy are fighting for the rich and make the poor poorer, I don’t have to say more.

  8. division

    There are more division among the people. Some say go this direction, some others say another while others say stay here. We will no longer stand one united people over time and the country will be weakened. No country or empire stay strong and shiny forever as proven from history.

    • Francis

      division, I agree with u 100%.

      singapore is so small and in my opinon, the only reason we did well in the past 40 over years is that we had one thing thay many countries dont — thats is people and govt are one united force.

      this united force is now being eroded.

      what else do we have that other countries dont, and with what do we compete with them?

      • division

        We are going to celebrate our 50 years of independence next year. Hope this will be a good reminder where we came from and how we reach today.

      • Francis

        TO THOSE RETARDS WHO THINK SINGAPORE US FOUNDED IN 1965, FUCK YOU!

        SINGAPORE IS THE ONLY COUNTRY WHICH DOES NOT KNOW ITS OWN HISTORY AND FOUNDING DATE 1819.

        FUCK PAP!

    • Vote Out Traitors

      Singapore was founded in 1819 by Stamford Raffles Lee Kuan Yew.
      And then in 1965, Lee Kuan Yew founded Singapore when Prime Minister of Malaysia kick Singapore out of Malaysia.

      Below is video of Lee Kuan Yew crying after he founded Singapore.
      He was so operationally ready to be Prime Minister of Singapore.
      SOURCE:

      • Chris

        Did u come from outer space? Or did u sleep through class?
        Does that explain ur lack of intelligence to understand what is going on?

      • Abdul Rahman - Singapore's Real Founding Father

        Actually hor.
        Lee Kuan Yew did not found Singapore.
        Prime Minister of Malaysia , Abdul Rahman, kick Singapore out.
        So actually hor.
        Abdul Rahman is the Founding Father of Singapore.

      • Chris

        We were lucky that they kicked us out.
        U r mistaken on ur theory. Alas, there will always be ignorant fools in this world. Dun overstretch ur intelligence to understand singapore’s history if it is beyond u.

      • Chris

        TO THOSE RETARDS WHO THINK SINGAPORE IS FOUNDED IN 1965, FUCK YOU!

        SINGAPORE IS THE ONLY COUNTRY WHICH DOES NOT KNOW ITS OWN HISTORY AND FOUNDING DATE 1819.

        FUCK PAP!

      • Albert Ng

        asking for higher CPF payout is benefitting the rich more, the people who benefit most are the high income group who got higher balance in CPF, those who don’t need to withdraw for housing. Who lost out the most? is the jobless and low income.
        So is Roy fighting for the rich or for the poor?

        If CPF interest is 6% or 10% the rich will not touch CPF for housing, using their normal saving to pay for housing will be a better choice, correct? To the lower income if they don’t use CPF to pay for HDB where else to get the money from? So you can clearly see Roy’s ploy is benefitting the rich more than the poor.

        People who donate money to Roy are fighting for the rich and make the poor poorer, I don’t have to say more.

  9. Chris

    Yes. But hopefully division is on the policies and not personally…
    Ppl must want Singapore to do well.
    It’ll be sad if certain ppl wants Singapore to go down due to their personal agenda.

    • PAP Does Not Equal Singapore

      “Ppl must want Singapore to do well.”

      How can Singapore do well?
      When only PAPigs & aliens do well.
      And Singaporeans suffer.

      What is good for PAP does not mean it is good for Singaporeans.

  10. Ravi gets 70k he isn't doing it probono

    Roy could have negotiated a settlement and 30k would have sufficed

    but because he is so addicted to publicity and attention, he wanted the case to go to court.

    he has already admitted to lying.
    and going to court is to assess damages which can enter into millions.

    he wants Singaporeans and his own friends and family to pay for it

    how much of his own money is he paying?

    Roy isn’t speaking up for Singaporeans.

    he is just addicted to publicity

  11. ho

    Next time when u go to the hospital for check up. Then Doctor told u got something serious and need to be operated Asap. The hospital breaks down the bill for u and told you that you can only claim this amount from your cpf and you need to pay the balance via cash or credit card. Then u will start to wonder why when u got so much money in your cpf yet u still need to pay cash. U r not using the money for anything else but just for this urgent medical bill. Then u will only realized u r screwed by the system…..

    • Chris

      Ho,
      No one in sg govt hospital was ever rejected operations due to lack of cpf.
      Did u go to the wrong hospital?
      U rich right? So go private, still complain here?

      • Chris

        U can go stay in another country which is cheaper. What to do? Gave u a better life then u dun want to pay.
        U think everything is free? Did ur employer say u r very cheap too? Or u r free?

      • ho

        Btw I read some of your previous post about unfair accusations. And here you are giving me your unfair accusations…anyway may good health be with u till the day u bite the dust. Hypocrite.

      • ho

        Oh ya. I will retire for and from this post. And I thought somebody wanted to do that…hypocite….

      • Chris

        Hi Ho
        If u think I’m a hypocrite then so be it. It is better than ppl who try to falsely accuse the PM.
        That is the lowest of low…

      • Chris

        Btw Ho,
        If u wanted a free lunch, it’s not gonna happen in Singapore. If u get admitted into hospital u will have to pay. U can be in subsidized wards and still receive treatment but still have to pay.
        U can move to some other countries where u will complain abt their taxes. But u can receive free healthcare. Did u see bbc? Due to lack of funds, quite a number of ppl died…. Good luck.

  12. Vote Out Traitors

    @ Kool @ 31 May @ 6.34pm;
    /// Conditions have to be made. Those who opt out will be left on their own. They should never expect the government to help should they used up all their money because these are also nations money from you and me. ///

    – since where got PAP government help Singaporean citizens with Singaporean tax payer’s money?
    – PAP got help aliens with Singaporeans tax money … definitely yes.

    • COMMONER TAN

      i don’t think its beneficial for cpf to be an opt-out scheme
      all else being equal, if all citizens are competent, can saves and invest wisely, that couldd have the same economic multiplier impact as a gahmen body doing it on behalf of everyone. question then is whether you can entrust every citizen to do so effectively. if you can achieve that nirvana then opt-out is OK. but i think its unlikely.because
      1. individuals do not have the broad access to capital markets that big funds like TH and GIC has and cannot scale their investments well
      2. even it they have, they do not have bargaining power or enjoy information asymmetry

      so where else can they invest (read lose money) in? local stock market where its a zero-sum game and banks, brokerages, remisiers win, retailers lose? or retail investment products whose returns are compressed by ‘management’ fees? the other alternative would be local real estate where cpf can already be used.

      bottom line is… given the choice many people WILL opt out, get their money and spend it today, fuelling today’s inflation and reducing future consumption power. now that is still ok as that risk can be managed down by singapore’s reserves
      but what if singapore needs to restructure its economy one day (as an small and open economy it has to adapt to prevailing global trends and anticipate the future well) and entire industries gets washed away, what is going to happen to these people who now have no jobs and no savings? it will be morally wrong for the gahmen and society to turn their backs on them… but you can guess who will be paying for their safety nets

      i rather most of us focus on bettering ourselves and be economically agile, self-reliant than ask for more $$ today. it just has to be sustainable. the ones who should ask for more money today are again the elderly and economically displaced ones not lazy people who want more handouts. cpf should indeed be more flexible to cater to the needy

    • Albert Ng

      asking for higher CPF payout is benefitting the rich more, the people who benefit most are the high income group who got higher balance in CPF, those who don’t need to withdraw for housing. Who lost out the most? is the jobless and low income.
      So is Roy fighting for the rich or for the poor?

      If CPF interest is 6% or 10% the rich will not touch CPF for housing, using their normal saving to pay for housing will be a better choice, correct? To the lower income if they don’t use CPF to pay for HDB where else to get the money from? So you can clearly see Roy’s ploy is benefitting the rich more than the poor.

      People who donate money to Roy are fighting for the rich and make the poor poorer, I don’t have to say more.

      • minchi

        Albert what if giving a higher return like the 6 – 10% you quoted might help people to achieve their minimum sum which they would otherwise be able to?
        And if the government expects people to sell their homes to retire, then it doesn’t matter whether you use your CPF today for a house later on does it?

      • Albert Ng

        Did the government impost any rules that says you must achieve minimum sum? so what is the problem since CPF is pension fund? It is suppose to give you some kind of insurance for old age, who know how long can you live?
        where does the money coming from to pay higher CPF interest? using the returns from GIC investment? will that not only reduce the foreign reserve of the country? The high income earner are fortunate enough so you don’t come up with some lame excuse to help them further please.

  13. minchi

    Hi Roy

    I’m a singaporean based overseas and I would like to support your cause but I’m unable to wire the money to your POSB.

    I would like to urge you to seriously consider setting up a crowdfunding website in order to enable not just overseas based Singaporeans but also non-singaporeans to contribute in support of your cause.

    I applaud your courage in trying to speak up about your beliefs in spite of the personal risks and I hope I am able to help in a small way.

    All the best and keep the articles coming.

    Regards

    M

  14. RoyCheatMyMoney

    Roy, why didn’t you show the $50k I transferred to your account???? Why you show 30k only? Don’t ge siao ok…

  15. Tan Choon Hong

    For almost 50 years we lived in the shadow of absolute power.
    Roy Ngerng stood up and spoke.
    Now he must confront a force beyond our imagination.
    Will those for whom he speaks rally to his aid or
    will they forsake him in his hour of need.

    Do your bit so that in your golden years you can tell your grandchildren,
    “I was there and together we made a difference.”

    • Ravi gets 70k he isn't doing it probono

      There is no place for grandchildren if we follow Roy’s policies.

      They will be paying the price of looking after you and me when we get old through heavy taxes. 🙂

      • goh kan heng

        On the contrary, today’s youth has no future, considering the sky-rocketing property price that keep doubling once every five years. Did our salary increase at this rate? If no, then the future generation is effectively paying for the retirement of the current generation to sustain the “asset enhancement” strategy by the PAP government so that they can sell off their over-priced homes to next generation of losers.

    • Chris

      Tan
      U r really funny. R u staying in Qing dynasty? If really absolute powers then u can still sprout these words?
      Even more so in this Internet age. But if ppl think that they can spread falsehood and hoodwink the ignorant. Such ppl must be stopped.

    • skeptical

      What makes you so sure Singapore will still be around then for you to tell a story? We are so small and anytime will be eaten by our neighbours. Our NS is just an illusion. We might also be claimed by China.

      • 1kickko

        u like your nick skeptical… as long usa around no countries dare to do that.. cos they’re not stupid enough to pay a price for that… China not xiao lah to swallow something not theirs & later have to spit out

    • Lawrence

      The poor oppositions such as the Low Thia Khiang, Chiam See Tong will be so sad and hurt to know that what they did is not considered as standing up against the PAP and speaking for the common Singaporeans.

      Instead a guy such as Roy who uses half truths, sensationalism and insinuations is considered as the ONE and ONLY Singaporean who dare to stand up against the PAP.

      • Daniel Chua

        CST n J BJ and many are the braves ones. So are those who have been ” accused” n subjected to imprisonment. Those who spoke out are Singaporean. brave or not ? Stupid or not is relative but they don’t deserve the treatment. Pap failed us in many area. I concluded through my working years ..no need Roy to tell me. I don’t think it is necessary to hold CPF beyond 55; it’s a fixed contact, once altered breeches good faith, and trust. .in democratic country this can’t do.

      • Ken

        PAP has failed us in some areas especially in recent times but they did helped us as well. Yes CPF has areas that can be improved, but I am just curious, what if we allow Singaporeans to withdraw all their CPF at 55, and they spend all of it and have none left for retirement. There will definitely be people like that who get overwhelmed with all the money they received suddenly and just spend most of it away. How can we prevent this kind of problem?

      • Chris

        Hi ken,
        No way to prevent once u return them their money. U can teach every citizen financial management, but u can never expect everyone to achieve financial prudence or investment acumen on their own.
        If possible, everyone will become warren Buffett Liao.

  16. Ravi gets 70k he isn't doing it probono

    I am glad people are donating to Roy actually. I too would like to see this case in court. it would be much fairer for Roy and Ravi to meet PM and to apologise personally.

    PM is a magnanimous man. It is easy for people to demonise those they do not know.

    Maybe PM will have compassion for Roy, who in my opinion, is just desperate for attention and validity.

      • Abdul Rahman - Singapore's Real Founding Father

        Learnt English from the same school as your mother.
        Your mother and I taught you English together while your father was at work.

      • Francis

        he is just voicing his opinion, how did he offend you? just because he has a different opinion as you ?

      • Chris

        It’s ok…
        It just goes to show the calibre of the oppositions or Roy fans here.
        Sad that they r our fellow Singaporeans.
        I really hope they r foreigner trying to sow discord though…

  17. vinz

    Many PAP fanboys wants to know how roy uses the money that people willing donated to him. However when it comes to the money in cpf which is by law that all have to contribute, they seem unconcerned on how is it being managed in details. Puzzles…

      • votes destroyed

        Fuck off PAP for our education system which produce these FUCK people. These are fucked up people around who knows no simple human respect. You as fucked up as PAP.

    • Chris

      Who cares abt how he uses the money? Idiots want to donate then donate lor. As long as Roy didn’t break the law, why Need to disclose?
      Cpf, Gic, th and such are guarded by Singapore law, constitution. AG and stat boards. If u dun believe then must show u everything. Why do u even want to stay in this country?

      • Francis

        TO THOSE RETARDS WHO THINK THE CPF IS FULLY ACOUNTED, FUCK YOU!

        SINGAPORE IS THE ONLY COUNTRY WHERE THE PRESIDENT WAS TOLD IT WOULD REQUIRE 56 MAN YEARS TO ACCOUNT FOR THE RESERVES.

        FUCK PAP

      • COMMONER TAN

        chris…
        these people think the account general department and external auditors of TH are not trustworthy. they think its a conspiracy lol… so much hate….

        i think roy would also do well in jobs that do not require ethics… such as a private banker or stockbroker. he has a sure win formula

        1 add a few half-truths
        2 fire up people’s emotions
        3 convince people to part with their money

      • Chris

        Commoner tan
        Maybe. But if so many conspiracy theories then whoever in govt also the same.
        Even if they migrate also the same problem in their new country.
        Ppl who live like this will forever be unhappy. Most probably at home they also thinking some one will steal his money…
        Pity…

      • goh kan heng

        Hi Chris, what conspiracy are you talking about? I think what Francis wrote is a fact that was widely reported on Straits Times. It appears that you never read your own country’s news (or are you a foreigner?).

    • Lawrence

      Erm, I think most people are asking as they want to know whether Roy will practice what he preaches which is accountability and transparency. He did do that so that is good.

      But just because people are questioning Roy automatically means that they are PAP supporters? So Roy is the only one in the opposition? They can’t support Sylvia Lim, Low Thia Khiang or any other opposition?

      Furthermore, isn’t Roy encouraging us to question the government and not passively accepting whatever the government says? So we are just merely following what he says and question everything and everyone.

  18. please explain to me

    Tens of thousands of Singaporeans dealing with details everyday, working in Auditor General, CPF, GIC, Temasek here and overseas and not a single one has blown the whistle. But Roy here has!

    To me, it feels like people just want to find fault, they aren’t interested in facts. The facts are all there. I am just guessing that people don’t understand finance and economics.

    I guess these are the people that the foreign talent are replacing (which LTK promoted recently), because we all know that we need the foreign workers to build things since it is beneath Singaporeans. Too many young people are growing up with maids and mothers doing stuff for them, they are destroying this country with their shit stirring. grow a spine lah

    • Chris

      Roy should have worked harder in school then get into GIC, th, or wherever. Then he will have a higher chance to uncover something from within.

    • Daniel Chua

      Same IB with different names going round to claim citizens find fault. Tell you what go back to loong n tell him ..dissolve parliament now, hold an election based on no GRC (if dare, which I doubt) and if he wins again ..I LL ..the more he act against Roy the more faith I lost. One principles NEVER ask another Singaporean to leave a country just because you are in disagreement. .unless you are doing a laid job (I understand your rice bowl at stake. .Please state so)

    • minchi

      To Please Explain To Me,
      SPH has over 4000 employees, and yet the journalists there have proven time and time again to print a slanted view where it suits the government’s agenda. Why is this?
      Could it be that you don’t bite the hand that feeds you???

      • please explain to me, and please use details

        I am talking about misappropriation of funds, criminal acts and corruption.

        Going by your logic, WP has hundreds of thousands of supporters possibly millions…
        Why can’t WP come up with some policy ideas?

        Straits Times makes no denial about being pro-Singapore and being the govt mouthpiece. Their former editor even wrote a book DETAILING what it was like, called OB Markers.

        Nation building has its trade-offs but just because someone holds stuff back from you, you want to accuse them of corruption?

        what are you, 12?

  19. Francis

    TO THOSE RETARDS WHO TRUST THE CPF SCHEME WITHOUT QUESTIONS, FUCK YOU!

    SINGAPORE IS THE ONLY COUNTRY IN THE WORLD WHERE CPF MINIMUM SUM KEEP INCREASING, WITHDRAWAL AGE KEEP DELAYING, INTEREST RATE KEEP STAGNATING.

    FUCK PAP

      • Francis

        thats the only thing he knows. must have gone through a lot of shit and now blame the govt for everything. His bitterness made him behave this way, so let him be. nobody wants to be stupid and bitter, so we should pity him.

      • goh kan heng

        I think Fancis, the green one, is stating the truth here. Chris, you say sg is not the only country keeping interest rate low, can tell me which first world country do that and what is the interest rate and contribution rate? Or are you the one reading fiction stories here since you can’t substantiate.

    • Chris

      Btw, sg is not the only country keeping interest rates low. I see u read too many fiction stories online.
      Try reading and see the news sometimes. Understand wats gg on before u type or think.

      • goh kan heng

        Hi Chris, which country are you referring to? I remember there is a comparison made by Roy showing Singapore collecting the most from its citizens, but giving the least. IF you can show me a chart showing otherwise then I will believe you. Else, you are sounding like a story teller here.

    • Samuel

      If you are so smart, why are you not providing detailed and valid solutions that will benefit everybody?

      Join the one of the opposition parties and announce your solution that will allow everybody to retire comfortably with lots of cash and without any cons. Plenty of people will vote for you. I will definitely vote for you.

      • Chris

        Well that’s a good question, I’m not smart.
        I feel the govt is the smartest but they also dun have all solutions.
        I feel USA is the greatest economy in the world. But they were one of the main cause of the financial crisis. Now, they r still the greatest economy….
        So many “why”? Becos no matter how perfect a person or a system, there r flaws. But one has to look at things objectively.
        Do u kill the goose that lays the golden egg just becos today’s egg is smaller?
        Even if it doesn’t improve, until the next golden goose comes along, I will be happy cuddling my golden goose “in my hands now”.

      • Chris

        Btw, I dun think I’m stupid either…
        Just feel the need to put things into perspective if some one tries to “not give the whole picture of things”.
        U did learn in school projects, right? There r many wrong info in the Internet today, becos ppl just cut and paste from various sources. This is the fastest way to pass knowledge. But ppl reading must use their brains to think through the information presented. V important!

    • Daniel Chua

      There’s no need to use vulgarity. To be able to put point across the “action verb” is unnecessary. Pap don’t learn so does the IB they are just some poor soul who depends on this to bring up their family. It must have also pain them when instructions was to tell detractors to leave Singapore. Right dear Singaporean who are IB for PAP. You don’t mean it right?

      • Chris

        I see more unruly Langauge from Roy’s fans….
        But I was unsuccessful in preventing these…

      • Lawrence

        Yes dear Daniel Chua from the IB for Roy.

        See how nice is it to assume? So base on your theory, speaking up for Roy equal to being the IB for Roy and questioning Roy equal to IB for PAP. It’s so nice to know that Singaporeans are not complicated and can be divided into two camps only, IB for Roy and IB for PAP.

    • unsympathetic

      You seem only capable of intimidation tactics towards people who actually have a right to support PAP policies as you have the rights to support Opposition policies. Roy advocated speaking out and questioning – why are you doing the exact opposite by going all wild and gorilla on people who do not share the same views as you? Can you not respond in a calm and reasonable manner?

      You are a disgrace to the Internet because there are many neutral people who are sitting on the fence; and the way you project yourself is a disgrace to honorable people who work hard in Opposition matters to raise awareness.

      If your present output is founded from the bad decisions you have made in your life nad you are suffering now, you really only have yourself to blame, while others who have done better are in better places in their lives now.

      Don’t get personal. Be objective. Accept differences. Accept that others do not agree with you and you do not need to resort to such hate and foul mouthed tactics.

  20. Pingback: All HWZ "elite". Why your name not in the Roy donation remarks? - www.hardwarezone.com.sg
  21. Duh

    Roy, run as an independent candidate in the next election. I will support you. I see the opposition a fool and coward so meek. I am completely disappointed with them.

    • Chris

      Duh,
      In order for u to support him, u must tell him which constituency u belong to…
      Not telling u to say here. But just reminding u. 🙂

  22. Lamo

    Some people won’t love you no matter what you do and some people won’t stop loving you no matter what you do. Go where the love is !

  23. Deaf Frog's toothpick

    Judging from the comments here, some ppl are secretly shocked by how fast Roy’s donations are stacking up, shocked enough to the extend that they have to turn up the volume, ironically that must be paying a great compliment to Roy.

    If the current CPF framework is really so infallibly correct, this whole wave of debate online and in parliament on CPF would not be taking place now. There would probably also be no need for one clarification after another and repeated regurgitation of the same textbook answers. Repetition might mean desperation.

    I’ll repeat what i said right from the beginning of this saga, how many actually stood up for the PM before Davinder Singh was sent in as vanguard?

    If the answer is none here, then I worry very much for the PM if these ppl we see now are supposedly his supporters.

    • please explain to me

      If I told you the truth would you be able to accept it?

      Roy annoys people.

      Why? No one likes know-it-alls. Everyone has met one – in school, at work. They irritate everybody.

      Some people are just more irritating than others. Some find Tin Pei Ling irritating, others find Vivian B irritating. Everyone probably finds Kenneth Jeyaratnam irritating.

      A lot of people find Roy irritating.

      🙂

      • please explain to me

        Because Roy is so irritating, people are happy to fund his lawyer’s fees to send him to his grave so all of us can watch a show.

        He was even manipulated by Joshua Chiang to promote something!

        Manipulated by his lawyer maybe because the decision to go to court is really funny given all the facts.

        Ravi earns 70k, Roy gets the attention he craves.

        What is the best outcome? the govt translates cpf and makes it idiot-proof for people who do not understand finance or economics. who didn’t pay attention in school and now have to do shitty work.

        Roy masturbates his friends and thy masturbate him back.

        when he is a bankrupt he will have no one to masturbate for

      • Be Realistic and Rationale

        I concur.
        He acts like a schoolboy who was reprimand by the teachers for his wrongdoings, yet head home crying wolf to his family members, neighbours, relatives etc. hoping to gain sympathy.

    • cleareye

      saying u yourself isit.. want to jump side.. in fact most oppose him are not pap supporter, only fools cant see that clearly… a lot of original siding began to curse him when looking the cb way he response to the letter..

      expecially with the FIRST APOLOGY when he CLAIM ALL THE POSTING IS UNTRUTH as though he is going to save himself from the boiling water…

      & remember that is the very true self when u’re really tested/// but however a lot donators are those big time hatred of gov…

      they just ignored the very facts of the calibre of this person as long there are chances for them to disturb the gov regardless price

      • please explain to me, and please use details

        Yeah. Wasn’t it Roy who asked his lawyer to tell PM to sue him?

      • Chris

        Daniel,
        I encourage u to take bk ur cpf.
        So many better countries out there for u to choose from.
        Bye…

    • Chris

      Deaf frog’s toothpick,
      Hi yo… Yes, the cpf is not infallible, PM and his govt looking into it Liao. But it’s not becos of Roy. Last few years’ ppl dialogue, unions, etc. Had allowed the govt to understand and work at what to do.
      The question is how? Many things need to look into:
      Increase cpf contribution, will bosses be happy? Will u be happy?
      Increase interest rate? How to continue putting money into our reserves to ensure continuous survivor of Singapore beyond this and next generations to come
      Cheaper housing by building more, change the supply and demand and balance it to ensure housing price will not collapse.
      And many more other issues like national security, fertility rates, immigrations, etc…
      It’s definitely not a walk in the park…. Govt needs to work as a team to fulfill its obligations and deliver.
      Please stop these “lee family” crap? Even when LKY was PM, he had a great team. U can complain the current team is not as strong but u cannot be naive to believe that PM can control everything in sg. R u nuts? Even the CEO of the mnc runs as fast as his team of executives…

      • Chris

        Btw, “lee family” comment was not directed at u but at anyone who’s naive to think so….

      • Chris

        No la, I also wish they up our cpf interest rate and also contribution ceiling….
        But if they dun then too bad Loh…
        I will not slander anyone to get my way… That’s undemocratic, I’ll use my vote…

  24. Be Realistic and Rationale

    I have no idea why everyone is supporting Roy.
    By defaming and misrepresenting, he got himself into trouble with the law, and now he is stirring emotion from the minority of the Singaporeans to obtain sympathy via donations for his cause.
    Now, to ask, what is the purpose of the donation? To fill the pocket of the lawyer, Ravi? Or to help ease his burden of the fine from the person who sue him? Why should Singaporeans pay for it when it is in fact his fault for misrepresentation and defaming the other party?
    Now let’s say the charge of libel is 1million. The amount raise will be insufficient and Roy will have to declare bankrupt. So how is the donation helping?

    Singaporeans have to start being objective, realistic and rationale over this case.
    CPF has being used for housing, yet people complain. If there’s no CPF, i strongly believe we will have many homeless soul living off the streets or renting flats from the government as seen in Hongkong.
    Thou i strongly disagree with the constant rise in the minimum sum, however a minimum sum is always needed to help majority of the Singaporeans who can’t even save their money.

    A simple question to ask yourself, before the age of 40, after deducting all the loans, do you have at least a liquid assets of 500k? 200k? 100k?
    Do you have investment(stocks etc) running in 100k? 200k? 500k?
    If you do not have, thank the government for the minimum sum. Because you belong to the class who will not be able to survive without the government intervention. And i believe you will spend all your CPF in a very short span of time, bringing problems to your children in the near future to pay for your medical and daily expenses.

    You want back your CPF? Go get a 2nd property and rent it out. The cash obtained is a “withdrawal” from the CPF used to pay for your property. When you have enough, and since the minority Singaporeans assume the grass is greener at the other end, go migrate. Renounce Singapore citizenship and you will get back everything including the minimum sum.

    • Albert Ng

      asking for higher CPF payout is benefitting the rich more, the people who benefit most are the high income group who got higher balance in CPF, those who don’t need to withdraw for housing. Who lost out the most? is the jobless and low income.
      So is Roy fighting for the rich or for the poor?

      If CPF interest is 6% or 10% the rich will not touch CPF for housing, using their normal saving to pay for housing will be a better choice, correct? To the lower income if they don’t use CPF to pay for HDB where else to get the money from? So you can clearly see Roy’s ploy is benefitting the rich more than the poor.

      People who donate money to Roy are fighting for the rich and make the poor poorer, I don’t have to say more.

  25. Leonard

    To clarify to all of Roy’s supporters, just because people are questioning Roy does not automatically means that they are PAP supporters. Is Roy the only one in the opposition? Can’t they support Sylvia Lim, Low Thia Khiang or any other opposition as opposed to someone who uses half truths, sensationalism and insinuations to gain more supporters?

    Furthermore, isn’t Roy encouraging us to question the government and not passively accepting whatever the government says? So we are just merely following what he says and question everything and everyone.

    • Chris

      That is true. I am not a pap supporter and I have said many times.
      I dislike Roy. Not becos he is advocating this cpf or gay thingy. But becos he:
      No1- falsely accuse our PM.
      No2- doesn’t present both pros and cons of cpf, HDB, etc… One sided points just to present his claims. Didn’t his university teach him not to do that?
      No.3- govt had done more good than bad, keep harping on freedom of speech and expression. Isn’t he ratting for so long Liao. Does he not understand u can speak, express but u cannot falsely accuse others. This is basic human etiquette.

      • unsympathetic

        Very good points raised. Do not be intimidated by the foul mouthed replies of opposition supporters here who resort to intimidation tactics to shut other people out, which is a complete irony given how they are always lamenting PAP is forcing things down their throat and they employ the same philosophy subconsciously.

        Reason and truth will always prevail – time and history will judge.

  26. Albert Ng

    asking for higher CPF payout is benefitting the rich more, the people who benefit most are the high income group who got higher balance in CPF, those who don’t need to withdraw for housing. Who lost out the most? is the jobless and low income.
    So is Roy fighting for the rich or for the poor?

    If CPF interest is 6% or 10% the rich will not touch CPF for housing, using their normal saving to pay for housing will be a better choice, correct? To the lower income if they don’t use CPF to pay for HDB where else to get the money from? So you can clearly see Roy’s ploy is benefitting the rich more than the poor.

    People who donate money to Roy are fighting for the rich and make the poor poorer, I don’t have to say more.

  27. Cashonline

    David vs Goliath. David Ngerng, you have won many Singaporean heart in your second day of fund raising. Perhaps Mr Goliath Lee has miscalculate such outcomes. The fund raising do not need to stop at 70K, the more the better. Just be accountable with the fund. It will serve as wake up call for our Mr Goliath Lee. 2 cents of advise

    • Albert Ng

      asking for higher CPF payout is benefitting the rich more, the people who benefit most are the high income group who got higher balance in CPF, those who don’t need to withdraw for housing. Who lost out the most? is the jobless and low income.
      So is Roy fighting for the rich or for the poor?

      If CPF interest is 6% or 10% the rich will not touch CPF for housing, using their normal saving to pay for housing will be a better choice, correct? To the lower income if they don’t use CPF to pay for HDB where else to get the money from? So you can clearly see Roy’s ploy is benefitting the rich more than the poor.

      People who donate money to Roy are fighting for the rich and make the poor poorer, I don’t have to say more.

    • Chris

      Cashonline,
      I hope u just speak for urself. He certainly didn’t win mine.
      If he had been more objective, then maybe.

      • Be Realistic and Rationale

        I have no support for Roy Defamation and baseless accusations. From the look of it, less then 1% of Singaporeans is supporting him.if you base on donations amount.

      • Chris

        Less than 1% is too many becos slander against anyone is deplorable. Whether rich or poor, such rules must be adhered.

  28. Joseph

    To the MIB…not that you donre bad job but your arrogant attitude in making policy…metting out make Singaporean boils! Yah sure u hv set up group claiming to listen to the peoples voice and concern…damn your meagre effort in this respect! MP suupose to bring out peoples concern?! From Sembawang to Tg Pagar GRC where I stay now…this clown only is great actor that NEVER brought up issues I raised because that will make them looks bad! Same to LHL..TCJ..VB..this beaurecrat CANNOT bother resply to my email..to my concern!!! YOU DESERVED THE LOSS OF PEOPLES SUPPORT!

    LHL..LOOK CLOSELY…you pick to silence dessenter in Court…you pick to bankrupt typical Sg knowing very well this poor soul CANNOT AFFORD to pay for LITIGATIO COSTS!!!

    LOOK CLOSELY LHL…In LESS than 2 days…Roy manage to reach more than the half way mark! This go to show how much Voters you loss!

    Today you may gave eliminated one Dissenter…this episode goes on to show there is 10…100..1000s of Roy! WHAT ARE YOU GOING TO DO NEXT?! BANKRUPT THEM?!!!

    • Francis

      did the PM ever say he wants to bankrupt Roy? he only said 5k is rejected. did he ask for more money ?

      • Chris

        Francis
        Ppl dun understand that PM just wants a proper and sincere apology. Not after apologies and promise to remove his post and video, still put these up in another place. What sort of apology is that? As if it is:
        “I slap u on ur left cheek, then I say sorry. Gave u plaster. Then I turn around, slap u again on ur right cheek. Then try to say it’s not me.”
        Will anyone accept that?
        PM asking for compensation is just following the procedure. End of the day, if u had done every thing sincerely. There is a high chance he’ll just waive it off. PM had never hankered over such things. I read that he donates such money to charity… Correct me if I’m wrong.

      • Francis

        chris, I’m just saying the PM didnt ask for more money. do we need to argue on this?

    • Albert Ng

      asking for higher CPF payout is benefitting the rich more, the people who benefit most are the high income group who got higher balance in CPF, those who don’t need to withdraw for housing. Who lost out the most? is the jobless and low income.
      So is Roy fighting for the rich or for the poor?

      If CPF interest is 6% or 10% the rich will not touch CPF for housing, using their normal saving to pay for housing will be a better choice, correct? To the lower income if they don’t use CPF to pay for HDB where else to get the money from? So you can clearly see Roy’s ploy is benefitting the rich more than the poor.

      People who donate money to Roy are fighting for the rich and make the poor poorer, I don’t have to say more.

      • Chris

        Sadly, the rich will benefit more whether policies go left or right as long as it is fair. Such things happen in any civilized countries.
        That’s why our govt advocates donation, drives donations and issue various policies to help the poor and under-achievers. These will help them and their next generations to move up the social ladder. Doing so also will decrease the number of educated ppl to do menial work…
        Any policies will act both ways. Just have to make sure it will eventually benefit Singapore, not jus the poor or the rich.

      • Deaf Frog's toothpick

        @ yours is a false dilemma argument, higher interest rates means that both the wealthier and poor benefit at the same time, but the rich benefit “more” by virtue of having a larger capital sum to roll in the interest. it’s not an either or, rich vs poor situation where only one group can win.

        this false dilemma can be easily solved by using variable interest rates, beyond a value, the interest rate decreases, there is already a similar mechanism in CPF now, we only need to refine it and make it better.

        In the same way, flat rate GST we are having now benefits the rich more than the poor, according to you logic, those who support flat GST is also fighting for the rich, so lets get rid of the GST, baby goes out with the bath water.

      • goh kan heng

        I agree with Deaf Frog.
        When they cannot win an argument, they will confuse you.

    • Be Realistic and Rationale

      PM Lee has being very forgiving with many bloggers who posted wrong information. All he wanted was the posted to be removed and a sincere apology. Roy was insincere and add fuel to the situation by posting further remarks after his apology. Can’t you guys see Roy is totally digging his own grave on purpose?

      • Chris

        Some ppl see, some ppl dun.
        Just need to make sure ppl who dun see is pointed in the right direction….

  29. Sing

    Roy, pls replace WP as the leader. Idoits like Thia Khiang who cannot speak well and no substance looks like a fool. I am sure WP will be much stronger with your leadership.

      • Chris

        That’s funny Francis.
        But we shouldn’t judge mr low in such manner. Mr low is a respectable person. Not entirely right not wrong.

      • COMMONER TAN

        yes, i respect mr LTK
        we shouldnt judge people by the standards of the language they use
        most importantly he is able to hang on to his mission of being an opposition’s voice, in a calculated and reasonable manner
        the ball is in gahmen’s court to clarify how and why it does certain things, and do a much better job at PR in order to communicate with today’s well educated generation

    • Be Realistic and Rationale

      At least LTH has yet to be sue for defamation and providing misleading information to the public.
      However rif Roy take over LTH, WP will closed down within weeks.
      Seriously the reason why PAP are still in power because there are people like Sing and Roy who embarrassed and demeaned the position of the opposition in the political society.
      If you ain’t smart or tactful in providing proper information, just support quietly by voting.

  30. PAP Joke

    Political Joke-Satire
    ——————————-
    Q: What does China call a Chinese guy who works for the Imperial Japanese Army in World War Two?
    A: Traitor

    Q: What do Singaporeans call a Chinese guy who worked for the Imperial Japanese Army in World War Two as a translator?
    A: Founding Father

    Q: What does India call an Indian guy who works for the Imperial Japanese Army in World War Two?
    A: Traitor

    Q: What do Singaporeans call an Indian guy who worked for the Imperial Japanese Army in World War Two?
    A: President.

      • Greg

        To start this post I want to give a disclaimer state I’m a citizen of the USA, I’ve never been to Singapore, and I really don’t understand the issues here beyond what I see as a human rights issue (the right to criticize even if you are wrong) which may be a unique thing from the USA. I found out about what is going on here from a series of facebook posts from a friend who is one of your fellow citizens. I have made a few comments in this and other threads, and I want to make it clear I am not donating at this point, because I feel this is an issue for the good people of Singapore to support or not, not someone like me from outside. I have been reading all of this to learn and to see what is common to all societies, and different in this case. So please take what I say as words from on outsider, and I hope it might show a reflection to think on.

        Albert: This is a post to make you think. The same thing can be called different things from different sides. I think this post is to show, that name calling distracts from rational arguments. The term “Traitor” here is being thrown around as a term to distract, and different people have different definitions of what one is. Could both sides use that term with some fairness to the other? In the correct context, yes. That is the trick of all politicians in the USA, and I assume world wide, and many of the press in the USA. Why not everywhere?

        Humorists make people think. That is why historically when a dictatorial government takes over i , one of the first groups silenced is the comedians.

      • COMMONER TAN

        greg…
        respecting human rights is tangential to respecting the law of the land
        roy is given his rights to freedom of speech, hence this defamation suit is civil and not criminal. and the same law applies to our PM as well (if PM defames roy, he is entitled to sue the PM)
        human rights is subjective, you also need to be clinical in defining what aspect of human rights was ignored here
        singapore is run by strong rule of law for decades and is ingrained in our societal processes and this has served us well
        don’t see the need to change

      • Rule By Law Is Not Rule Of Law

        “Civil disobedience, as I put it to the audience, was not the problem, despite the warnings of some that it threatened social stability, that it led to anarchy. The greatest danger, I argued, was civil obedience, the submission of individual conscience to governmental authority. Such obedience led to the horrors we saw in totalitarian states, and in liberal states it led to the public’s acceptance of war whenever the so-called democratic government decided on it…

        In such a world, the rule of law maintains things as they are. Therefore, to begin the process of change, to stop a war, to establish justice, it may be necessary to break the law, to commit acts of civil disobedience, as Southern black did, as antiwar protesters did.”
        ― Howard Zinn, You Can’t Be Neutral on a Moving Train: A Personal History of Our Times

        http://www.goodreads.com/quotes/tag/rule-of-law

      • Greg

        Commoner Tan,

        First I agree, your country is governed by the rule of law. So I hope is the USA. What I am finding interesting is the different directions this comes from. To be clear here, I am not saying that one point of view here is better than another. I am finding this interesting and in reading this I am learning a lot about your country’s politics, and in turn I am thinking about those of my own country. I will repeat that when it comes down to it, most of this is an argument for the people of Singapore, but bits I feel interested in commenting on. Please don’t take this in any way but dialog I hope to learn from.

        In the USA we acknowledge, even if we don’t always see it, that credibility wins arguments, not facts. This is a danger that has driven some countries to Dictatorships. To prevent this the USA really limits liable to situates where real damage can be measured in dollar amounts. A small paper saying that the Ford cars are bad or dangerous can not be sued, that paper is too small to matter. Even in large with the famous if it is a public figure, suing is not an option.

        Let me give you an example, you can google references if you want. There are a lot of Americans who feel that my President is not actually a citizen of the USA. That is he not of the religion he professes, and that he should not be president. These are not just people in the general public, but people like the Billionaire Donald Trump. Does this mean that there is no law? No. It means you have to demonstrate damages to sue, and it’s very hard to do this. And by making this hard, in a practical standpoint the press and the public can not be sued for what they say. This gives the protection to be wrong, and to be right. It removes control from the government of what the press says.

        Now before you start thinking that all american press lies, and for sure some does as it does everywhere by either intent or just misinformation, think about the business of the press. If you had only one news source the lies would be an issue, but if you have multiple sources, each hoping to be seen as more trustworthy that the others so they get more readers, the press polices itself, and it does it in public.

        From what I can see, your leadership had to sue Roy or it might look like Roy was right. In the USA, the leadership would ignore Roy, the press would sort it out, and it would never have become a big enough issue to be noticed by some one like me in the USA.

        No matter your view here, this is a public relations nightmare. Your leaders job is to run your country not to do this. I’d be more annoyed he was spending time on so trivial issue.

        Rule by law: Funny you should quote that. I live in what they call the “Deep South” in the USA. The 2nd largest bus boycott of the American Civil Rights movement happened a short walk from my front door. I’m not sure how it is over there, but here in the USA, the courts are arranged so that the citizens as represented by Jury have to give permission for someones rights to be taken away. What I mean by that, is that our Jury by right of something called “Jury Nullification” (a bad name if there ever was one) can find someone not guilty because the law is wrong. They judge not only the person but the Law itself. During the Civil right movement here, lots of cases were found “not guilty” even though the law as written was broken, because the law was found to be wrong. This is rare, hard to do, but there were laws at the time that prevented people of a certain skin color from eating at certain restaurants, owning land that they had bought, even from voting in some cases.

        I also think this should show that all laws in the USA at least changes with times, and hopefully improves.

        I think this in the USA goes back to the thought that the government rules by permission of the people, and the people can over rule the government when bad decisions are made.

        I leave you with one of my favorite quotes from the British Prime Minster Winston Churchill “Democracy is the worst form of government, except for all those other forms that have been tried from time to time.”

        I think that if you replace “Democracy” with “My Government” it still applies. A government can not satisfy every citizen all the time, people have conflicting needs, desires, and there are limited resources.

      • COMMONER TAN

        quotes like these make a lot of sense
        but they were made in the context of turbulent times
        so we need to also question its applicability today
        and what if civil and government can collaborate together to solve issues, breaking an invisible barrier? isn’t that also a good social construct?
        you know how they say sometimes its as simple as getting people to talk to each other. so the role of our govt is to facilitate that
        i believe in poetic justice in a democratic system so let nature takes its course

      • Chris

        Hi Greg,
        There is some fairness in your posting.
        Freedom of speech and expression is allowed in Singapore and it is encouraged. But to issue personal attacks and to smear anyone’s reputation or / and integrity is not allowed in Singapore.
        Respect of each other’s regardless of birth must be there. Only then, human rights can be achieved rightly. In every country, there will be individuals who resort to unruly behavior and if prevented to move fwd their cause. They claim that their human rights r being stifled or suppressed. Is this right of such ppl?

      • COMMONER TAN

        well greg.. i am not part of the leadership so i can’t quote them. but i think the leadership is suing him because it wants to set an example that 1) law has to be respected in singapore, whether the law itself is right/wrong is another matter 2) freedom of speech comes with responsibility
        the administration of law differs country to country and i don’t want to misconstrue your comments as saying the american way is the better way because it is better evolved and so on. like what churchhill is alluding to…i don’t think any system can claim its outright better or worse than others
        to your point on democracy, i think what people want and can bear will eventually find its own avenues of expression. if a singaporean don’t like the way PM handled this situation, he has a voting ticket to express his view. the democratic processes are working correctly over here (and by the way more straightforward compared to US 🙂 )

      • Greg

        Commoner Tan,

        Sadly I see that in the USA it is needed even in times that are not turbulent. Since the USA is so much larger that Singapore, I suspect things are more likely to get hidden here just in the size of things. Looking at local politics in the next town over (a very small town) the sheriff (head of police, an elected position) did some thing wrong. He tried to prevent this from becoming public, by first threatening to get a few people fired who had the evidence of what happened, then he tried to destroy the credibility of the reporter, who was trying to make this news public by calling him Un-American in public (a bad insult over here) and then in private trying to get him fired from his news paper by threatening to have advertising from his friends pulled from that newspaper so the newspaper would not be able to afford to keep printing.

        This happened just a few years ago. The Sheriff is now out of work, the paper is fine, but it is because he had no way to really stop him. If he could have sued him he would have. Just like many big businesses over here sue small businesses knowing that they will lose the suit, but also knowing that the small business will go bankrupt fighting them … unless of course, they choose to sell out, at a low price.

        I am not saying that this is what is happening here, but I am saying that this has happened in the USA in our history, and we decided that allowing suites like this where exact damages can not be defined could be used to allow the rich and powerful to control those without resources to fight.

        I will repeat what I said before, I don’t even understand the situation that Roy is accusing people over. I am still reading up on that. But I do see parallels to the what has happened in the USA’s history, and how yoru country has a different take on how to deal with it.

        Thinking about it, rights are defined by the country you are in, so rights I assume, that are rights in the USA, might not be rights in Singapore. I’d also suspect the reverse is true.

        What from my viewpoint is that a power like this libel lawsuit is could be abused. I ask you, what protections in Singapore are there to prevent someone with resources from making a lawsuit like this, and bankrupting the person he is suing, or by the threat of bankruptcy forcing him to publicly change his statement, even if he does not believe in changing his statement, even if the original statement might be true.

        As I said to prevent this, it is very hard to sue for Liable in the USA. How is this address in Singapore. Clearly I don’t know. There are always more than one way to deal with any challenge.

      • Tyrants By Any Other Name

        Democracy is not the law of the majority but the protection of the minority.
        — Albert Camus

        That which is not just is not law.
        — William Lloyd Garrison

        One who breaks an unjust law that conscience tells him is unjust, and who willingly accepts the penalty of imprisonment in order to arouse the conscience of the community over its injustice, is in reality expressing the highest respect for law.
        — Martin Luther King, Jr

        “If laws are unjust, they must be continually broken until they are altered.”
        — Josephine Ruffin

        The legislation of the government has been directed rather to the protection of the rights of money and property than to the best good of the citizen.
        — Susette LaFlesche

        It’s up to us, the people, to break immoral laws, and resist.
        — Cindy Sheehan

        “I hope people will not think we are encouraging people to break the law. But our actions should teach people, and children, to scrutinize laws against human life, and they should be broken to prove a point.”
        — Barbara Wiedner

        http://www.doonething.org/quotes/law-quotes-5.htm

      • Greg

        Commoner Tang,

        We seem to have posted at the same time, so this post is to respond to your last post so far in this thread.

        Oh, I hope things in Singapore are simpler are more strait forward than they are in the USA. If they weren’t due to the size of your country nothing could ever get done. My country in some ways is stupidly complex. We vote for everything over here, from big positions like the President, to little positions like the head of our local school boards, judges, people who oversee our water management districts (no joke).

        It takes work to be a knowledgeable voter over here, and far too many people just don’t bother to do that work.

        Something you said about in that last post about voting the person out if you don’t like them is very true. Here in the USA we have a new problem. They call it Term Limits. Some states, mine included, only allow someone for the state Senate or House (yes every state here in the USA has it’s own senate and house of representatives, not to be confused with the National one in Washington D.C.) Usually the term limits are a two years, for a two year position. It seems it takes 4 years to learn the job, so in the name of “get the bastards out” or with the idea people should not become politicians for life, we have taken away our right to keep someone we like. The flip-side of what what you just spoke on.

        There is another factor over here. We are an impatient people here in the USA. We want quick justice, and we want quite decisions. I think this is another reason we effectively prevent suing for Libel.

        I ask another question. Since liable is a type of damage, and there is a monetary value put on it in Singapore, how is this value calculated? I have no idea.

      • Greg

        Commoner Tan,

        One last thing. I do not think that the law in the USA is more evolved than any other countries. I am not familiar with how your government is set up, nor its laws, but I am very familiar with US law, the laws of the state of Florida in the USA. I am somewhat familiar with the laws on Mexico, Canada, England, France and Israel. As your country developed from a very different tradition than any of these countries, I can only guess that it has a different viewpoint, is effected by a very different history, and has a different set of cultural values that it is based on. What is important is if the law is good for you, not if I agree or even understand it.

        I can say that looking at the countries I do at least partially understand the laws and constitutions of, the USA is no more messed up than any of the others, it has some advantages as it is very hard to change the constitution, that prevents radical changes and forces careful thought to major changes to the law of the land. It also tends to protect the rights of the minorities, the people that the majority would disagree with, and it lets their voice be heard too.

        Mexico and Israel seem to be not so good on this last point, Canada seems very good on this point.

        I’m still wondering how the minority voice, correct or not, has protections if it does in Singapore.

        Thank you for chatting with me about this. I am finding this very interesting.

      • COMMONER TAN

        i agree greg…. there is a lot of unnecessary complexities which governments introduce from time to time to buttress their hold on power, or simply to confuse the hell out of everyone

        in terms of the share of power between the goverment (do-ers) and people (receivers and judge) there ought to be a balance struck between fairness and efficiency. fairness in the sense where everyone has an equal voice, and efficiency in the sense where the same people can come to logical conclusions that yield the most benefit to them in the quickest possible time. it seems from your comments that in the US its slanted towards fairness at the expense of efficiency. and undoubted we see that from hot topics within amercian politics… gun laws, obamacare, etc. there has to be an optimal solution that can be mathematically substantiated, question is how to get there by navigating the bipartisan politics, self interest groups etc, right?

        to your last point on actual liability, since its a civil suit its a private settlement between plantiff and defendant so don’t know

      • COMMONER TAN

        oh and on your last question greg…
        i don’t think there is special protection of the minority (does minority = people with different views? or minority = people who don’t obey the law?) but at the same time there are no special laws to suppress them
        any local lawyer can comment?

      • Greg

        Commoner Tan,

        If you call something as part of civil law, but if it could be used as a political tool, a tool to silence opposing speech by making the price of free speech too high, can you really call it a civil law suit? It is something else. It has a punishment (super high cost, possible bankruptcy) for something that does not have a price of damages. I think this is the issue where we divide between your culture and laws an those of the USA. The goal of a civil law suit is to set the time back. If you hit someones car, your liability is the value of the car, or the value of the repair. If you physically hurt someone it could be for the cost of medial care, and cost of potential lost work in the future (there are tables and formulas to calculate this) but if you just publicly accuse someone of something, what damages can be address monetarily?

        Here is one of those interesting cultural differences I’ve been watching. In the USA as I have said, it would have just been ignored. Addressing it would give it legitimacy. It seems that our cultures differ because in Singapore if this suite was not filed, your Leader would be seen as proving your leader was in the wrong. In the USA just the opposite would happen, it would made our leaders look defensive and like they were hiding something. We go by the Shakespear quote from his play Hamlet “The lady doth protest too much, methinks.” and it looks like a sign of guilt.

        As for obamacare, guns, things like that, the issues are more complex than they seem on the outside, and a lot of that comes from the size of the USA. often it is easier to see it as six to eight countries that have different needs. But I can address some of this.

        Guns are an issue more in the big cities, but in the more rural states (Nebraska has a population of 1/2 million for a state bigger than England) guns are needed. People die from wild life. People still hunt for their own food. People are spread out so far, the nearest police can be a 4 hour drive away. In cities thisis clearly not the case. This is complicated by the fact that when the constitution of the USA was first written, people still remembered that the citizens needed to rise up and take over the government from the British. A citizen that is armed can organize and can overthrow the government. As I have posted our constitution is hard to change. I’m not saying that this is needed any more, but a surprising number of people in the USA feel it is. (or better yet, they thing the UN is in control and will take over the USA … don’t look to me ot defend this idea. Not doing it.)

        Obamama care might be a closer comparison to what I see is happening issue wise in Singapore. We do not have a national heath care system. People in the USA die every day from cheaply and easily treated medial issues. For the costs of healthcare to be evenly spread, everyone needs to be on it no matter if its paid by government or paid for by individuals. Otherwise, disproportionately the sick get on heath care, and the healthy (or healthy for the moment) don’t pay for it. Spreading the costs is the key, and there are many ways to do this. Obama care is one. Lots of arguments here about people being forced to pay for something they cant or won’t use. What should be covered. Is this actually a new tax. Will this create/destroy jobs. Even though the government is the largest purchaser of drugs for people, it is not allowed to negotiate for a bulk price for the drugs, so the government is actually charged more for them, and a lot more than you in Singapore would be for the same drug (or your government).

        Yup, we’re screwed in this case, but at least people are trying to make it better.

    • Chris

      Sad…. If u r joking abt ur own country.
      If u r not Singaporean, then dun poke ur nose here.
      No decent Singaporean will joke abt our country. Even the lowlife in Singapore dun do that…. Tsk tsk…

      • goh kan heng

        I see it as the hard truth based on facts which could be easily found in the memoirs written by those people.
        Not a joke. 🙂

    • Libel - Singapore Politicians Get Highest Awards ???

      That’s what my lawyer friends allege.
      Is this true?
      Highest amongst all the different professions?

  31. JOKER

    Yeah, read some of the comments, people saying to read blah blah blah CPF FAN saying that its stupid, we cannot change anything whatsoever. People will squander their money.

    Put it nicely, the govt is caring for the people and trying to ensure that they have a living with our aging population

    But come to think of it, don’t you think they are controlling us? We are humans, we have our own will so PLEASE.

    READ? SERIOUSLY READ? HOW MANY PEOPLE THAT IS ILLITERATE (OLD PEOPLE) IN SINGAPORE WITH THEIR CPF TIED DOWN YOU KNOW? NOT EVERYONE HAVE THE SAME EDUCATION SYSTEM AS YOU.

    Can’t they make a better choice then having a “Minimum Sum”?
    e.g. those who managed to skip the policy, if they sell their flat, they still need to put the money back into CPF. Ridiculous? We who use CPF money to buy the flat which is our own money but when we sell we need to pay back? Whats the point then?

    Seriously for those who say that those donor will be hiding, yeah i supposed it will happen, ME TOO. But if this continues till the next election comes, everyone knows what will happen FAN BOY.

    Just my 2cents/personal opinion. Not saying that it is not good just that I am sure there are better ideas.

    • COMMONER TAN

      you hit the nail on the head
      should the age limit be raised to 67?
      follow-on implication is should i give you $10 over 10 years or $5 over 20 years? which one better suits retirement needs? after all you are just returning my money to me
      these are questions which CPF board should come out and discuss

      minimum sum is secondary

    • Be Realistic and Rationale

      Did you take the CPF to pay for your flat? If you did you definitely have to put it back. It’s common sense.
      Minimum sum is a form of savings, although increasing it yearly is not favourable, however i believe it a minimum sum is always needed.
      As i mentioned earlier post, unless before the age of 40, you have have substantial savings either liquid assets and investment (in 6 digits) AFTER deducting loan, you will need the government to take care of you once you are old.

    • Chris

      Hi joker,
      U r right! But r u living in utopia?
      Most of ppl who invested in the mini bonds that flopped a few yrs bk were literate as well. If mas did not step in, do u even think the banks will return a cent to these investors? Not a chance, if they go according to the t & c.
      So u think that mas should jus leave them in the lurch since only a few singapore’s in trouble…
      If it’s half the population of Singapore then govt shouldn’t help too, leave them to die la, is it?.

    • Be Realistic and Rationale

      As a free thinker, your sentence is totally biased and very sensitive. Do respect other religion.
      Cheers!

  32. Greg

    It makes me feel better to know that Flame Wars and name calling is a universal skill that the good posters from Singapore, and most people in the USA have in common. 🙂 Being polite on blog comments is very rare in the USA, and it seems to be a universal trait. That and yelling in all caps to prove a point.

  33. Layman

    The comments here make Roy sounded like some deliberate personal attack on PM. I believe it all started with a very simple query on CPF s interest and inflation. And the root of it is the increased cost of living. Be it rich or poor, everyone wants to feel financially secure. Shouldnt we be more open to questions? Afterall, our PM had earlier encouraged Singaporean youngsters to speak out and be more articulate.
    Like any celebraty, sitting up there is inevitable to received comments and criticism. Is pretty normal. Some like, some dun, some hate. There is the tradeoff of wealth, power and popularity. Conclusion: be magnanimous. Afterall Roy is close to half PM s age.

    • Be Realistic and Rationale

      We can all speak up and be more articulate BUT let it be ambiguous and not add names into questioning.
      In this case, Roy was Insulting and insulating others on corruption which is not a question but a direct confrontation that is totally unnecessary.
      “Roy is close to half PM s age.” means his experience is insufficient, thus why is he even fighting a full fledge war with him now. Learn from other experience bloggers, apologise sincerely and move on and learn from this mistake. That will solve all the problem.

    • Lawrence

      Insinuating that someone is corrupted is not a criticism. It is an accusation that can damage LHL and Singapore’s reputation and maybe make investors think twice before investing in Singapore if enough credulous people believe it and spread it such that it becomes the accepted truth.

      • please explain to me, and please use details

        No it did not start from CPF.

        Roy was free to blog about CPF, gay rights and whatever he felt like.

        The moment he accused PM of misappropriation of funds, he got sent a letter of demand.

        This blog is still up isn’t it?
        He is still free to solicit funds isn’t it?

        Roy, stop being such a spineless faggot causing problems and then crying victim. Hate people like that.

        you are a disgrace to the gay community

    • Lawrence

      By writing factual essays about CPF and including all the facts instead of half truths, sensationalism and insinuations. How would LHL be able to file legal actions against him if he had stick to real facts?

    • please explain to me, and please use details

      what is Roy’s qualifications to write?

      has he ever worked in CPF?
      did he specialise in economics?

      what on earth does he mean by “healthcare worker”?

      does he volunteer with aids victims or the elderly or is he an administrative support staff or does he clean tables?

      what does he do?

      why is his background so vague ?
      does he actually have a job?

      • goh kan heng

        I am not a Roy fan, but why people want to attack the messenger instead of the message? Sounds dubious to me.

      • Chris

        Goh
        U mean he’s carry out someone’s task when he accused PM for wrong doing?

      • goh kan heng

        Hey Chris, can you be clearer? I catch no ball here? I mean your balls. 🙂

      • please explain to me, and please use details

        obviously no one knows what Roy does.

        not even his supporters

        who are giving him their money to meet the minimum sum he set for them.

        so lol.

  34. Roy

    -The CPF is designed in a way to cater to the AGING people of Singapore.
    -It was conceived, like all other pension funds, to help the less educated people of the population.
    -The conception, and any other changes made to this pension fund, has ALWAYS had logical reason to back up the changes being made.
    -This ensures that the CPF can ONLY improve with time. By “improvement”, it means that it will benefit the majority of Singaporeans. NOT all Singaporeans. Some will always fall through the cracks.
    -Anyone and everyone is welcome to dispute the changes being made. However, you generally do not want to baselessly insult the lawmakers in an attempt to dispute changes.
    -If you DO dispute a change in the CPF, you have the responsibility of explaining WHY the change is unfavorable to the MAJORITY, not to some individuals only, and then you MUST suggest an alternate solution, if not at least explain why the status quo would still be better than the changes being made.
    -Our government is one of the most transparent ones, believe it or not, and so reason and logic will prevail, should there be an intellectual discussion, and if you’ve read till here, you’re probably educated enough to NOT want the opposition to be in power, and only to be a threat to the incumbent.

    • Chris

      Roy,
      Did u wake up one day to suddenly talk sense? Lol….
      Just kidding. In sure that, This Roy is different from the other Roy….

    • Greatest Speech - For Singaporeans

      “I’m sorry, but I don’t want to be an emperor.
      That’s not my business.
      I don’t want to rule or conquer anyone.
      I should like to help everyone if possible; Jew, Gentile, black man, white.
      We all want to help one another. Human beings are like that.

      We want to live by each other’s happiness, not by each other’s misery.
      We don’t want to hate and despise one another. In this world there is room for everyone, and the good earth is rich and can provide for everyone.
      The way of life can be free and beautiful, but we have lost the way.
      Greed has poisoned men’s souls, has barricaded the world with hate, has goose-stepped us into misery and bloodshed.

      We have developed speed, but we have shut ourselves in.
      Machinery that gives abundance has left us in want.
      Our knowledge has made us cynical; our cleverness, hard and unkind.
      We think too much and feel too little.

      More than machinery, we need humanity.
      More than cleverness, we need kindness and gentleness.
      Without these qualities, life will be violent and all will be lost.
      The airplane and the radio have brought us closer together.
      The very nature of these inventions cries out for the goodness in men;
      cries out for universal brotherhood; for the unity of us all.

      Even now my voice is reaching millions throughout the world, millions of despairing men, women, and little children, victims of a system that makes men torture and imprison innocent people.
      To those who can hear me, I say, do not despair.
      The misery that is now upon us is but the passing of greed, the bitterness of men who fear the way of human progress.

      The hate of men will pass, and dictators die, and the power they took from the people will return to the people.
      And so long as men die, liberty will never perish.

      Soldiers!
      Don’t give yourselves to brutes, men who despise you, enslave you; who regiment your lives, tell you what to do, what to think and what to feel!
      Who drill you, diet you, treat you like cattle, use you as cannon fodder.
      Don’t give yourselves to these unnatural men – machine men with machine minds and machine hearts!

      You are not machines, you are not cattle, you are men!
      You have the love of humanity in your hearts!
      You don’t hate!
      Only the unloved hate; the unloved and the unnatural.
      Soldiers! Don’t fight for slavery!
      Fight for liberty!

      In the seventeenth chapter of St. Luke, it is written that the kingdom of God is within man, not one man nor a group of men, but in all men!
      In you!
      You, the people, have the power, the power to create machines, the power to create happiness!
      You, the people, have the power to make this life free and beautiful, to make this life a wonderful adventure.

      Then in the name of democracy, let us use that power.
      Let us all unite.
      Let us fight for a new world, a decent world that will give men a chance to work, that will give youth a future and old age a security.

      By the promise of these things, brutes have risen to power.
      But they lie!
      They do not fulfill that promise.
      They never will!
      Dictators free themselves but they enslave the people.

      Now let us fight to fulfill that promise.
      Let us fight to free the world!
      To do away with national barriers!
      To do away with greed, with hate and intolerance!

      Let us fight for a world of reason, a world where science and progress will lead to all men’s happiness.
      Soldiers, in the name of democracy, let us all unite!”

      ― Charlie Chaplin
      Read More: http://www.knowledgeoftoday.org/2013/09/the-greatest-speech-ever-made.html

  35. Duh

    Support! I will give you a percentage of my CPF should you be successful in getting 10% returns for me. I put my invest in You. Hope you get me many times my return. Hurray! Please share us what is your next big project. I like to invest too.

  36. WP

    I hope those people that are supporting Roy are the minorities and does not represent Singagporean by and large. If he has stick to his stand and facts from day one, he would have earn my respect although I don’t agree with what he wrote and said. I remember the late JBJ used to stand by what he said and even to the point when he was bankrupt, I see him standing outside MRT stations selling his books to raise funds. He has my utmost respect as he stick faithfully to his beliefs and ideology. But what Roy has demonstrated is just the opposite. Issue apology which means accepting that what he said is false, on the other hand send to various media outside Singapore. When he knows the lawsuit is coming, he ask for public fundings and claim to be one that is fighting for the rest of the Singaporeans. What the world is coming to?? Indeed if this is the product of our generation, I am very sadden by our generation.

    To those that wanted full subsidise medical: In countries with this system, the income tax is generally 40% for the medium incomes. The GST can be as high as 17%. In return the people get full free medical. This has resulted in a lot of practitioners abusing the system. They issue a full range to medical health supplements to the public and claim it back from the government. They are now hiring more administrators than practitioners in these sectors to control that. Secondly, the better ones goes to the private service and eventually a sub standard public medical service resulted. The poor has no choice but to go to the public hospital whereas the rich will go to the private.

    To those that wanted foreign workers out: In today’s context, they are already competing with us regardless of whether they are physically in Singapore. Singapore relies on investment from foreign MNCs and the ease of accessing the right skilled workers is one of the top attracting reasons why they want to come here. By shutting them out, is as good as asking them to pack and relocate their investment to other countries. Furthermore, our SMEs is heavily reliance on foreign labour because there is a heavy structural unemployment in Singapore for certain industries.

    I am typical Singaporean earning a decent income and has never stay or work in other country but seriously if you ask me, I really have not much complains about what I am getting here.

    • goh kan heng

      Maybe he want to let it rest by issuing apology even though he has not defame the PM. Sorry, but which generation do you belong? Why write off the generation when Roy is just one person from that generation? What the world is coming to? This is Singapore, why talk about the world?

      Income tax 40% for top earners is reasonable considering the obscene amount of money they earn in a year. Ask LHL how much he earn in one year what takes others a lifetime. It is fair to ask him to foot more tax to enjoy protection of his assets by our NSmen. GST 17%? Yeah, some countries don’t even have GST, why not compare with those? Full medical bill is fair. This is part and parcel of a social contract between government and its people. What if you get some rare MERS virus and its not covered by your current medical insurance? Pooling of resources together as a society to lower the risk of financial ruin due to some medical catastrophe not of one’s making is very fair. Why you cry foul? As for medical cost going out of control, government can always step in to provide check and balance.

      Your rant on foreign workers dones’t make sense. There are many jobs that need the person to be physically in Singapore that has gone to foreign workers. Also, there are many businesses that won’t go out of business just because foreign labour not available. These include F&B, construction, service, etc. There is always demand. So, no need for foreign workers to come in. If government don’t let them flood our labour market, Singaporeans can have a decent income instead of third world income.

      I am a typical Singaporean too. Uh, aren’t you complaining now?

      • redee

        Hey, dont give all these shit. Its all about the money and individual. Whoever can bring benefits to oneself and make life better for you, you choose the person. WP will benefit oneself and fight for more benefit, you and me will select. if roy can get more cpf returns youand me will support him more. Do you think one support whoever is for good for everyone? This is realistic and selfish world. You will only consider for your own good only. We wont really care about other, this is the truth although we say consider about others, this is bullshit to get accepted in public eyes.

      • owen

        You guys are frog in a well who are too comfortable in the protection of the govenment here and didnt know. The income tax for middle income is already 40-50%. This is what I pay when I worked in UK. Go check their tax. I am sure you will not pay after you read it and do your own calculation. Go do a few years stink outside.

      • Be Realistic and Rationale

        Goh Kan Heng, you are biased and totally irrational in your reply. Let’s analyse it.
        there is literally no meaning in your 1st paragragh. Roy has defame the PM. He issued an apology, but on the other hand condemn his apology in youtube and his blog. PM thus did not accept his apology as Roy was totally insincere!
        If you have no idea what happen, please do not assume!

        There is no such thing as vast selective income tax on different levels of citizens. What the inital writer WP is stating, if you want low medical fees in public hospitals
        Citing UK as an example, be ready to pay 20% tax if you earn below 50k and close to 40% tax if you earn above that? If you are willingly means you are not intending to increase your salary?
        And Value added tax(GST in singapore) can go up to 20% citing UK instances.

        You want no GST, want low tax, yet want low/free medical bills. Go join third world countries or religion run countries. You will be able to enjoy such benefits. Compare apple to apple, orange to orange. Be fair and rationale.

        Why are jobs lost to foreign workers? Singaporeans are choosy with jobs, salaries and love to job hop. My friend who owned a SME company since 1991 with 100 plus workers employed close to 20 Malaysians. Why? Because Singaporeans whom he initial employed tend to job hope and it is tedious to re train new employees. And salary to his workers are already 5%-10% higher then market rate for that particular profession. Thus whose fault is it? Singaporeans? or Foreigners?

        If no foreigners were to come in, many MNC will relocate due to high cost of running the business. Some had already relocated to Malaysia, others Indonesia as their Asian HQ due to government intervention on F.W. for the past few years. With such relocation, 60-80% of the employed Singaporeans in the particular MNC will be retrenched. SME will suffer as they lose businesses from these MNC, resulting in many shutting down or relocate.
        F.W. is always needed BUT inflow can be restricted in terms of numbers or professions. Administrative and blue collar jobs should always go to Singaporeans.
        Look at macro point of view instead of a biased micro point.

    • johnson

      Maybe u should be replaced by a foreigner, then u won’t talk like that. 不见棺材不流泪! Sorry no offense, u are just ignorant of current situation in Singapore.

      • please explain to me, and please use details

        i would sooner hire a foreigner than people like you. kpkb from dawn till dusk

      • goh kan heng

        That’s why government need to tighten the flow. We have many people here who would rather hire foreigners than their own. These people are most likely to be new citizens. And to tell you the truth, they will take out their CPF, sell their flat and migrate to greener pastures when there is an opportunity. I know many of them, mostly PRC. Singapore is just their stepping board and it is stupid that the government allow this to happen.

      • please explain to me, and please use details

        you would think that won’t you?

        I would rather hire someone hardworking, motivated and positive who was willing to prove himself or herself and was grateful for the chance to work for me in this country

        than some kpkb person like Roy

        all this time he spends on the Internet…does he actually have a job or did he just make one up called “healthcare worker”?

        is he just some unemployed volunteer worker?

        no worries, the truth will all come out in court.

        at the moment, it looks like only Ravi and Davi stands to gain. 70K is an excessive sum to pay a “human rights activist lawyer”

        can’t believe they are so out to con people.

        remember ar – the 70k is ravi’s fees k? not davi’s fees not damages none of that

        70k goes to Ravi.

        for a case to access damages.

      • Albert Ng

        asking for higher CPF payout is benefitting the rich more, the people who benefit most are the high income group who got higher balance in CPF, those who don’t need to withdraw for housing. Who lost out the most? is the jobless and low income.
        So is Roy fighting for the rich or for the poor?

        If CPF interest is 6% or 10% the rich will not touch CPF for housing, using their normal saving to pay for housing will be a better choice, correct? To the lower income if they don’t use CPF to pay for HDB where else to get the money from? So you can clearly see Roy’s ploy is benefitting the rich more than the poor.

        People who donate money to Roy are fighting for the rich and make the poor poorer, I don’t have to say more.

    • Albert Ng

      asking for higher CPF payout is benefitting the rich more, the people who benefit most are the high income group who got higher balance in CPF, those who don’t need to withdraw for housing. Who lost out the most? is the jobless and low income.
      So is Roy fighting for the rich or for the poor?

      If CPF interest is 6% or 10% the rich will not touch CPF for housing, using their normal saving to pay for housing will be a better choice, correct? To the lower income if they don’t use CPF to pay for HDB where else to get the money from? So you can clearly see Roy’s ploy is benefitting the rich more than the poor.

      People who donate money to Roy are fighting for the rich and make the poor poorer, I don’t have to say more.

      • Deaf Frog's toothpick

        @ Albert Ng
        yours is a false dilemma argument, higher interest rates means that both the wealthier and poor benefit at the same time, but the rich benefit “more” by virtue of having a larger capital sum to roll in the interest. it’s not an either-or, rich vs poor situation where only one group can win.

        this false dilemma can be easily solved by using variable interest rates, beyond a value, the interest rate decreases, there is already a similar mechanism in CPF now, we only need to refine it and make it better.

        In the same way, flat rate GST we are having now benefits the rich more than the poor, according to you logic, those who support flat rate GST is also fighting for the rich, so lets get rid of the GST, baby goes out with the bath water.

        and you are using the same repetition tactic, well, if you wish to put your own intelligence on trial by doing so, so be it.

      • Be Realistic and Rationale

        A Higher CPF interest benefits everyone, not only the rich.
        Flat rate GST is fine if taxation shows a vast difference between the poor, middle and wealthy. Like UK, taxation is 20% for the poor, 40% for the middle(would prefer 30-35% thou) and 45% for the rich.

      • Deaf Frog's toothpick

        justifying flat rate GST with income tax is simply silly,

        if you are paid $800/mth, 0% income tax, 10% flat rate GST, no other variables, you ok?

        the school holidays have started, fair enough, i should not expect too much.

      • Albert Einstein

        I disagree that the rich benefitting more from CPF. The maximum contribution is capped at a salary of $5000. In fact, the rich are benefitting by not having to put their money inside the CPF as they can invest in stocks which give a much higher return.

        Trust me. I am Albert – Albert Eistein.

      • Be Realistic and Rationale

        1stly, why are you against GST?
        If you do not want a flat rate GST, what do you propose then? A variable GST? No GST? Ridiculous!
        Just for your info, other countries are having VAT as high as 20%, thus @ 7%, i have no idea what are you ranting about.

      • Deaf Frog's toothpick

        flat GST is a regressive tax, variable GST is far better than flat GST.

        Cherry picked statistics from other countries are always silly, Brunei is imposing Sharia law, therefore you want it too?

        monkey see monkey do argument, it’s like plucking a deer’s horn and put it on a cat’s head and saying: “ok it’s not that bad, it could have been worse.”

  37. Deaf Frog's toothpick

    there has to be an adjustment of expectations but the question is from who?

    example 1,

    we have an entity that advertises itself as a luxury sports car and retails for the price of a luxury sports car, BUT,

    it gobbles petrol like a luxury sports car, is expensive to maintain, but thats where the similarities end, because unlike a real luxury sports car, this one is not very reliable, and does not go very fast despite making a lot of noise.

    and we expect the car buyer to adjust his expectations?

    example 2,

    we have an entity that says, he wants to buy a car which is: faster, better, cheaper.

    basically we are looking at something that goes like a luxury sports car but is fuel saving like a small japanese car, and selling at the cost of a china car.

    if there such a thing?

    and we expect the car seller to adjust his expectations?

    which of the above is more worse?

      • Deaf Frog's toothpick

        fact is if you are too slow or not sharp enough, you cannot participate in a conversation, thats what bimbos do all the time, but the trick is, not letting ppl find out this fact.

  38. Chua

    Social mobility is very real in Singapore. 30 yrs ago I was from a rented one n half room flat housing 6 of my family members. Now the combined income of my dad, sis and myself exceeds one million with each of us doing ok in our chosen unrelated profession. Spend ur time and talent upgrading urselves instead of lamenting things outside ur circle of influence. No question each of us were probably lucky but effort plays a part too. Cpf is not perfect Singapore is not perfect PAP definitely far from perfect. But which country or party or system is? Vote them out, migrate, make it work for u or keep complaining is ur choice.

    • How Stupid You Think We Are

      /// … instead of lamenting things outside ur circle of influence. ////
      @ Chua

      You mean we can never vote out PAP?
      You mean convincing people to vote Opposition is outside our circle of influence?
      Really ah!

      Sincerely
      3 year old child.

      • Be Realistic and Rationale

        Opposition have to learn to attract talent and sway votes from the educated and not focus on just the uneducated. Look at the guy above who can’t comprehend simple English. What’s the point of having such supporters? Makes one wonder if opposition every win, the standard of Singapore is going to drop dramtically

    • Be Realistic and Rationale

      I totally agree with you Chua.
      Plan ahead, invest and upgrade oneself will definitely help in ensuring a better future for our family members rather then complaining and complaining about CPF, government etc.
      That is the problem with that mere 1%-2% of Singaporeans.

  39. Hey

    Ok guys, objectively speaking on a neutral point of view. If i donate, is my money going to,

    1) Directly improve our CPF system in anyway?
    (How?)

    2) Or is it after saying so much about fighting for Singaporeans just plainly going to help Roy pay off his legal fees because he defame others.(He admitted he made false info bout the CPF)

    Sounds like 2) is whats happening here man. I tink its good that Roy is concerned about Singaporeans well-being. But hey, you don’t have to commit a crime to do that man.

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